Ipad Touchscreen Lag/Latency

[shaftpolls]

Hi Guys,

I have one question for you :

I just bought a new Ipad 3 and I'm concerned about the fact that I don't find any drawing/sketching app that does not "lag" or have latency problems. I don't know about you, but I feel very disapointed since I feel like I touch the screen and the draw is not instantaneously, it is fast, however its not real time, if this make sense to you.

I'm comparing with the new/latest Android Phones, since I also tried and it works very well.

Do you know if this is related to the drawing software itself ? Or a limitation of the touch screen response ?

Thank you

Cheers

 

[AQ_OC]

It could be. You didn't name off any apps. The iPad as over 3 million pixels to deal with, so if the software isn't optimized you can have a lag. An app like Sketch Club lets you pic the resolution of the image...and you can see thta the highest one, for the retina screen, takes longer than the 1024 x 768 image. I can't say for sure which is creating the lag, though, the app or just the sheer number of pixels. I suspect the later but I would not bet too much money on it.

 

[shaftpolls]

Well I have been watching several drawing apps on youtube, others I installed (free versions).

I believe this is not directly related with Ipad 3, because the same happens with ipad 2.

Its not a big lag, its a small latency that you notice everytime you touch the screen, this can be seen easily if you do fast moves with your hand or stylus pen.

My only doubt about this is : Is this behaviour due to Ipad touchscreen hardware response, or related to the drawing software concept.

Unfortunately I think that this is related to Hardware, since Microsoft is researching new screens with greater responsiveness.

What do you think ?

 

[AQ_OC]

As I saw it work get in one app at least, I don't think it is anything to do with the responsiveness of the touch screen. Yeah, MS needs to be looking at screens because they are so far behind in anything to do with a touchscreen.

 

[elija.wattson]

Sure, it’s totally usable, but it never really feels like you’re fully in control. If you drag an app across the iPad’s screen, for example, the icon will dance around your finger a bit as the display tries its best to keep up. That’s not good enough for Dietz and his team, as they have whipped up a demo of how things ought to be — unlike the 100ms delay of a regular touchscreen, the demo knocks that delay between touch and tracking down to 1ms flat.The difference is staggering, especially when Dietz trots out the slow-motion footage. With the delay between touch input and screen response slashed by orders of magnitude, a device that sports the sort of super-low-latency Dietz envisions has the potential to feel far more (for lack of a better term) natural than its brethren. There’s zero delay when you slide a checker across a board, for example, and bringing that sort of instantaneous feedback to the many screens in our lives could help to bridge the gap between operating a bit of software and the feeling of interacting with objects.

 

[elija.wattson]

While you might think there is no lag at all with your latest touch device, if you pay close attention, you can perceive touchscreen latency when you are simply launching an app. Try using a painting app and you might notice that the line you’re drawing always seems to be following your finger instead of flowing from it.

 

[followthesapper]

Question. Who is Dietz? . I would like to see this demo if it is on YouTube.

 

[shaftpolls]

While you might think there is no lag at all with your latest touch device, if you pay close attention, you can perceive touchscreen latency when you are simply launching an app. Try using a painting app and you might notice that the line you’re drawing always seems to be following your finger instead of flowing from it.

Thats exactly my point. So I can assume that this is a Hardware limitation. It's a pity, however the next years will bring us surelly a new paradigm in that area. For me its very important the touchscreen latency, it's a underated feature that makes all the diference when interacting with devices like this.

I found that Microsoft video, and here everyone can notice what am I talking about...

 

[MattIM]

Thats exactly my point. So I can assume that this is a Hardware limitation. It's a pity, however the next years will bring us surelly a new paradigm in that area. For me its very important the touchscreen latency, it's a underated feature that makes all the diference when interacting with devices like this.

I found that Microsoft video, and here everyone can notice what am I talking about...

YouTube Link: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vOvQCPLkPt4

Thank you for your link. Now I understand. In the newly released Avengers movie, Tony Stark accesses computer systems with a tablet device and he explodes the monitor into the air and reaches for different virtual objects and examines the image in 3D. Later, when he and Dr. Banner are researching for a solution to counteract Loki, they use these huge see through tablet like devices manipulating data and instantly seeing the result on the object also viewed on the same device.

I can see where your concern moves our technology towards movie reality.

 

[shaftpolls]

Well, I feel frustrated since some new mobile devices like Sony Ericsson Xperia Arc S work with a very low latency..

Even my old Xperia X8 seems to work faster than the Ipad on that particular feature. Maybe that's due to the size of the screen, I don't know.

What I do know is that once you get used to lower latency response, you will never look back.

 

[AQ_OC]

Good grief. First, there is a spoiler in this thread. But most sadly, some of you folks are finding sometime to be "frustrated" about. What practical loss are you getting from the latency? I think it a lot of ways the latency is a good thing on a touch screen device. You can certainly noticing it when dragging an icon across the screen but so what? Why does the icon need to be right under your finger all the them? What have you lost by it not tracking you exactly? You're not moving a phyiscal object around, you're controling something, the delay can give an human time to make changes or to know that you don't want to lift your figure off because that icon might get the deleted if you do. Explain what is so critical here that you need 1ms latency? People have been able to make beautiful and amazing drawing on the iPad, so exactly what do you gain? This is just MS trying to dig themselves out of the hole they are in the tablet world. People will always find a reason to be unhappy with stuff.

 

[shaftpolls]

I'm not going to argue about the importance of this feature, because its just like the screen resolution. Some people do not find any added value or big difference in having higher resolutions, however once they get used to it they notice the piece of junk they had in the past.

Ipad 3 is wonderful don't get me wrong.

 

[MattIM]

Good grief. First, there is a spoiler in this thread. But most sadly, some of you folks are finding sometime to be "frustrated" about. What practical loss are you getting from the latency? I think it a lot of ways the latency is a good thing on a touch screen device. You can certainly noticing it when dragging an icon across the screen but so what? Why does the icon need to be right under your finger all the them? What have you lost by it not tracking you exactly? You're not moving a phyiscal object around, you're controling something, the delay can give an human time to make changes or to know that you don't want to lift your figure off because that icon might get the deleted if you do. Explain what is so critical here that you need 1ms latency? People have been able to make beautiful and amazing drawing on the iPad, so exactly what do you gain? This is just MS trying to dig themselves out of the hole they are in the tablet world. People will always find a reason to be unhappy with stuff.

LOL AQ_OC, me thinks your anti-Microsoft petticoat is slipping. I had the same initial reaction when I first read this thread. But the more I looked into it the more I understood the OP's frustration. I gave the Avenger movie as an example earlier but on a similar vein, when the iPad first came out one of the first complaints was how slow the buffering was when watching YouTube videos. I had similar experience with Netflix streaming video. Over time, Apple and the app developers resolved this so that now I can see any video without any lag or hiccup as the device buffers.

If you see The Avengers you will see a couple of scientists manipulating data, creating images, and 'touching' objects to see if there were any flaws to their design--all virtually available. It would take a lot of technology to get to that point. If scientists can take an iPad and give it the ability to design objects or manipulate formulas with visual results, that speeds up the design process. Microsoft is not the only company doing this research, IBM, Hitachi, GE and other companies are also doing this research...there are many scientists researching how to design new products that eliminate the build it and see if it works and then if doesn't, go back to the drawing boards way of developing and designing these products.

 

[AQ_OC]

MattlM,

I don't have an anti-Microsoft petticoat...I am actually pro-Microsoft. But let's face it, where tablets are concerned they are MIA. And they were one of the first tablet PC promoters, with the UMPC (ultra-mobile pc). I bought one...still have it. It cost me $1100 way back in 2006. They built in a lot of tablet support in the Windows. Heck, I have three tablet PCs...my latest one a Lenovo X220t, convertable with a touch/pen input screen.

In spite of that background, they let the tablet market get stolen by Apple. They might do a lot of reasearch, but they are not innovating with products much. They have other cash cows. And the fact is they have become fat, old, and lazy, in comparison to other companies today. This is the way of things.

I don't see how the 100ms latency affects negatively on anything you mentioned in your second paragraph. The place where latency would have an impact is if you were using a tablet to control a real device...as long as there is nothing in the real world that is tied to the end of your finger, then that latency is non-critical. But let's say I was directing something to a target...or remote controlling a flying object --- hey, there is a real-world example of that...those AR Drones....they are controlled by an iPhone/Android and they seem to work fine. I don't really know right this moment if the 4S has the same latency as the iPad, but I would imagine it does...but this is one example where you can control something in real time and still not have the latency mess you up. So if all you are doing is opening/using apps, then the argument that latency is some kind of problem is false...As I said...people seem to have a way of wanting to find stuff to be unhappy about. Heck if we were all perfectly happy all the time life would be boring, so I get this.

100 ms = 1/10 of 1 sec. On a human scale that is a fairly short amount of time.

Bring on the day when I can get real time control of my car or my lawn mower with my iPad...I still don't see low-latency is really important for those applications but eventually something will turn it where it is important. That is the way of things.

 

[andrzejls]

MattlM,

100 ms = 1/10 of 1 sec. On a human scale that is a fairly short amount of time.

Bring on the day when I can get real time control of my car or my lawn mower with my iPad...I still don't see low-latency is really important for those applications but eventually something will turn it where it is important. That is the way of things.

You will see BIG difference between 100 ms and 1 ms in car real time control. 100 ms --> hit the wall, 1 ms --> miss the wall. Take your pick. BTW iPad has 100 ms latency/response which is arerage, Prime 50 ms which is 2x better but you will still hit the wall.