Subscription services

[DaveSt]

How quickly we forget. Apple was directly responsible for the music moguls giving up DRM. Jobs was the one who got us the right to share songs over several devices, and to legally make digital copies of CDs we own. He established the standard pricing which sets a three tier price, with most being at 99 cents, albums at $9.99. Before, pricing was all over the place. Amazon book pricing was an attempt to do the same with books, that Apple did with music. If Apple was offering higher prices on books, don't you think they would have a lot more in iBooks. Apple is having trouble with the publishing industry because the publishers would not be the fat cats any more. Amazon made some bargains, but they are not pushing the publishers hard to make an effort. Jobs is a crusader, with the same powerful drive that has pushed Apple to the top, pushing the media industries to a new reality.

You have got to be kidding me ...

What Apple has a problem with is that people are buying their books from Amazon and other sellers and not through the App Store. Jobs is a crusader the same as Gates or any other business mogul. He is crusading for the most dollars in his pocket. You are right, he doesn't want the publishers to be the fat cats, he wants Apple to be the fat cats. Can't really blame him for that, so I guess it is up to each consumer to decide if they wish to support the methods.

How is Apple taking a 30% cut for purchases pushing the media industry to a new reality? Sounds like business as usual to me, just with a different boss.

 

[Diane B]

How quickly we forget. Apple was directly responsible for the music moguls giving up DRM. Jobs was the one who got us the right to share songs over several devices, and to legally make digital copies of CDs we own. He established the standard pricing which sets a three tier price, with most being at 99 cents, albums at $9.99. Before, pricing was all over the place. Amazon book pricing was an attempt to do the same with books, that Apple did with music. If Apple was offering higher prices on books, don't you think they would have a lot more in iBooks. Apple is having trouble with the publishing industry because the publishers would not be the fat cats any more. Amazon made some bargains, but they are not pushing the publishers hard to make an effort. Jobs is a crusader, with the same powerful drive that has pushed Apple to the top, pushing the media industries to a new reality.

I had understood that Amazon's book pricing was basically as loss leaders--to what point I'm not sure. Perhaps to establish the Kindle. I think its Random House and its smaller houses that are not working with Apple and that's a lot of desirable titles.

I do hope compromises can be made for both books and music from a purely selfish standpoint. i tthought today as I carried my Ipad (wifi) with me how much I use it every day. Today I used it to help a friend by email understand how to use Dropbox to protect and access on other computers a needed doc created in Office HD. As we traveled by car I did printscreens with handwritten notations for her and answered questions during the day using either free wifi at lunch with 4 free wifi sources to choose from or with phone hot spot while traveling. I did a directions map/text to where we were going, checked for restaurants in area, did handwritten notes of our visit (business), listened to dled Rhapsody on Touch through car radio (could as well have been on Ipad). Then when home added some files in Office and uploaded to Dropbox, participated in my photography forums and read a book borrowed from our digital library. I'd truly hate to give up my Ipad.

Diane

 

[Prasius]

I'm sorry Seadog - I just don't see things that way. Now, I don't deny that Apple probably did do some good with regards to insisting on allowing use across multiple devices, etc, but it's a little naive to think that's for any other reason than they want us to purchase multiple devices (like my iphone, ipod nano, ipad, AppleTV..). As you can see.. a cunning technique which worked successfully in my case!

What is "wrong" with pricing all over the place if that means a better deal for the consumer? I much prefer that on Amazon Kindle when it's cheaper than iBooks! Apple are doing this for their own reasons, don't kid yourself it's for yours.

 

[iPadCharlie]

If Apple had a decent selection of books, this potential loss of Amazon would not be that big of a deal... for me anyway. Truth be told, I really do prefer the overall "reading experience" of the iBooks app over the Kindle app, but no one can touch Amazon in terms of selection.

I have only purchased one book from iBooks (plus a few freebies), but I do use it a lot for generic ePbubs and PDF docs.

 

[Diane B]

Second to that. The reason I don't use Ibooks for anything other than pdf manuals and the like is the lack of books, pure and simple. I have no idea why Random House won't work with Apple but they are a huge publishing house with their smaller imprints that leave a gaping hole in what Ibooks can offer.

 

[DaveSt]

I like the iBooks app itself better than the Kindle app actually. The reason I don't use iBooks has nothing to do with availability really, it is more that I don't want to restrict my reader options that tightly. I have been reading my books electronically for years now, ever since my Palm III days. I have been through Microsoft Reader, Rocket, mobi books, Peanut Press and probably a few others all that had proprietary formats and proprietary DRM at one time or another. All is fine as long as you continue to use the device you purchased the books for. When you upgrade, all of the sudden your books are not readable on the new device, or they at least need to have the DRM stripped or the books reformatted.

With Kindle books there is much more device independence. I can read my books on any number of platforms without needing to reformat them. With iBooks that really isn't the case. Who knows what device I will be using in five years? Will there be an Android version of iBooks? How about a PC version? Windows Phone? I doubt it. Apple wants you to be tied to one platform. I've been down that road before, I don't plan on doing it again.

 

[DontUnderstandMyIpad]

Even if iBooks would offer all the same books for the same price as Amazon does would I not buy from iBooks. This is simply because iBooks is limited to Apple hardware, whereas the Kindle app is available for all major end user devices. I just think that this limitation goes too far. When buying from Amazon, it doesn't matter which devices I will buy in the future, as all major devices can read them. But with iBooks, I would be forced to always buy Apple hardware to access my ebooks. This may seem fine for the next two years or so, until the iPad gets replaced. But at the current time, I don't feel that I am in the position to say: 'Yep. Apple from now on till the end of the world.'

Edit:
Hhmmm, same thought as Dave.

 

[iPadCharlie]

Well with Borders having just declaring bankruptcy and B&N having been up for sale since last August, its pretty much going to be left up to Amazon and Apple as the major content providers. Now if they could only put Amazon's content with Apple's reading app, then we would have a real winner.

<====== NOT holding my breath!

 

[Diane B]

Even if iBooks would offer all the same books for the same price as Amazon does would I not buy from iBooks. This is simply because iBooks is limited to Apple hardware, whereas the Kindle app is available for all major end user devices. I just think that this limitation goes too far. When buying from Amazon, it doesn't matter which devices I will buy in the future, as all major devices can read them. But with iBooks, I would be forced to always buy Apple hardware to access my ebooks. This may seem fine for the next two years or so, until the iPad gets replaced. But at the current time, I don't feel that I am in the position to say: 'Yep. Apple from now on till the end of the world.'

Edit:
Hhmmm, same thought as Dave.

In truth, I guess I hadn't thought about that totally though I know I would prefer to buy something like epub that could be read on multiple devices but all of them have a DRM of some sort coming from publishers AFAIK. There are epubs out there without DRM but mostly ones I don't care to read or classics in public domain. I agree with Scott it is likely up to Apple and Amazon to duke it out in the future and I, too, am ot willing to tie myself to Apple until.....

That being said, I'm so ignorant of this. What other subscription services are available for music? I reslly had never thought about it, knew of Spotify in Europe, Napster here and Rhapsody. I decided to try Rhapsody and signed with 24 hours under my belt, so to speak, when I realized I had access to most music, could dl without limit for offline listening and that I could listen to new music and artists I might not have taken the chance on if I had to buy. Lots of pluses for me but Rhapsody says they won't comply with Apple's subscription policy. So where does that leave me. I know nada about other portable devices that can do similar. I'd sure prefer to continue to use my Touch and Ipad to access Rhapsody but that may go away. I know this is an Ipad forum but anyone be able to point me in a direction to do some research. I'm a good online researcher but I haven't brought up much helpful. I did find that the Zune isn't a possibiity for Rhapsody at least. My hope is that if the subscription music services now won't work with Apple that Apple itself will offer a music subscription plan. That hope doesn't have any real basis except I look at the huge new Apple server farm near me and think there must be something big coming.

Diane

 

[iPadCharlie]

That being said, I'm so ignorant of this. What other subscription services are available for music?

Actually, Amazon is a great source of MP3's. I listen to mostly classical music and there is even stuff on Amazon that the mighty iTunes does not have! <GASP!>. And if you are into classical music, there is a magnificent site for public domain music called Classic Cat - the free classical music directory. iPods (and the iPad app) play MP3's quite well and it is easy to add them to your library with iTunes.

 

[Diane B]

Actually, Amazon is a great source of MP3's. I listen to mostly classical music and there is even stuff on Amazon that the mighty iTunes does not have! <GASP!>. And if you are into classical music, there is a magnificent site for public domain music called Classic Cat - the free classical music directory. iPods (and the iPad app) play MP3's quite well and it is easy to add them to your library with iTunes.

Misunderstanding. i don't want to buy but stream. I have a big library of both CDs and mp3s but when I discovered for $9.95 a month I could have lots of new and old and dl as much as I want for offline listening I was hooked. I had had a budget I tried to adhere to for buying music LOL but this allows me to go way beyond what I would normally buy and, as I said, be willing to try new artists and music I wouldn't ever buy. I'm pretty diverse with classical (and BTW thanks for the link to the public domain classical site), jazz and in contemporary music like the singer/singwriter genre or whatever with a lot of splashover from other genres. Oh, and ethnic too. I'm very open minded about music (hope about other things too LOL).

 

[DaveSt]

Misunderstanding. i don't want to buy but stream. I have a big library of both CDs and mp3s but when I discovered for $9.95 a month I could have lots of new and old and dl as much as I want for offline listening I was hooked. I had had a budget I tried to adhere to for buying music LOL but this allows me to go way beyond what I would normally buy and, as I said, be willing to try new artists and music I wouldn't ever buy. I'm pretty diverse with classical (and BTW thanks for the link to the public domain classical site), jazz and in contemporary music like the singer/singwriter genre or whatever with a lot of splashover from other genres. Oh, and ethnic too. I'm very open minded about music (hope about other things too LOL).

If you are jailbroken, Grooveshark is a pretty good service. Grooveshark Anywhere allows you to download music for offline playing and it allows you to make playlists for any of the music on the site. Apple won't approve the application though, so JB is a requirement.

 

[awais2611]

I've even wondered about thr Apple TV and Netflix. An app isn't involved but nonetheless one of the main reasons for most buying the Apple TV is to stream Netflix. If I can't stream Netflix to my Ipad to watch while traveling or on my exercise bike, can't stream Rhapsody (or similar subscription music which can be downloaded for offline listening) to my Touch, can't use the Kindle or Nook app to read---that will definitely push me away from the Ipad. I reslly thought Apple would approach this differently, esp. now with other tablets in the wings but they don't seem to be backing down.

 

[Thphilli]

I've even wondered about thr Apple TV and Netflix. An app isn't involved but nonetheless one of the main reasons for most buying the Apple TV is to stream Netflix. If I can't stream Netflix to my Ipad to watch while traveling or on my exercise bike, can't stream Rhapsody (or similar subscription music which can be downloaded for offline listening) to my Touch, can't use the Kindle or Nook app to read---that will definitely push me away from the Ipad. I reslly thought Apple would approach this differently, esp. now with other tablets in the wings but they don't seem to be backing down.

The other tablets in the wings is exactly why they are doing this. They want to make sure that the content providers that currently use their platform don't offer any better deals on any other platform. So they are basically forcing them to raise their prices everywhere if they want to stay in the iOS ecosystem.

 

[Seadog]

For those who are not aware, the latest report is that the app store is operating at a loss of 19%. This is a major incentive to crack down on apps that allow people to buy directly from the vendors. And for those who think 30% is too much, check the profit margins of other stores.